Luke Skywalker: Pansy or just plain awesome?

[Zaine]

Pansy. Case closed.

[sparrow]

Case reopened.

Just plain awesome.

Now it's closed.

[Twysper]

Case reopened for more support! He has my vote for being awesome too. One of my favorite scenes from the movies is when he destroys the AT-AT on Hoth with a concussion grenade. X)
Awesome deeds over whiny words and all that.

[caedus]

well regardless im a fan and always will be. hes pimp and he took down two of the most feared sith, i will defend him to death

[Mara]

Hmm... we should count up the votes.

[caedus]

i think most would say hes a pansy.........but we all know thats subjective to everybodys opinion.

[Mara]

True.

And my vote counts for 20 votes.







Kidding.

[caedus]

that would be epic.

[saga6th]

Ok I have a feeling looking at the posts that I am going to get alot of angry responses. Luke is my favorite and I would argue the most powerful Jedi to date. Following thread of defeats Obi-Wan beat Maul, Dooku beat Obi-Wan Ep III Anakin pawns Dooku after he owns Obi-Wan,(granted Obi-Wan beats Anakin in Ep III but there were extenuating circumstances and Vader kills him later) Luke after just 5 years of training most of which was on his own defeated Vader phyisically and mentally. Vader also defeated the Emporer who knew Anankin was stronger. The Emporer also technically beat Yoda admittedly not by much. So if we follow are thread to the end we find Luke on top of them all. Also in the books Luke deals with one aspiring conquerer or sith after another becoming extremely powerful. Last but not least ep V and VI Luke just oozes cool choking Gamorean Gaurds who get in his way. Hacking Wampa's arm off. Fighting Vader after lets face not more than a month of formal training and surviving. Kid has power. I have a lot more to say but I don't want to take up any more space.

[Meira]

(granted Obi-Wan beats Anakin in Ep III but there were extenuating circumstances and Vader kills him later)

I'm going to have to disagree with you here. I think the only real extenuating circumstance of Obi-Wan defeating Anakin is that Anakin gave in to his emotions, yadda, yadda. Anakin's power at this point in time is intense, but he's also confused and stuff. BUT, he defeated a whole lot of Jedi at the temple, so his confusion doesn't get too much in the way. So my ruling (and it means something... cuz my name is in red *nods*), is that Obi-Wan's defeat of Anakin is legit.

Now, as far as Vader defeating Obi-Wan in Ep. IV.... Obi-Wan LET him do it. So that doesn't count like... at all.

Yeah, I'm an Obi-Wan fan.


Now, as far as Luke....

The thing about Luke is that, yes, he was a pansy to start with. But if you take his entire life into account and see how he grew from that whinny little farm boy into litterally a leader of the galaxy and Jedi, I think you will agree that overall, he led a pretty awesome life, like him or not.

[Mara]

Nov 16, 2009 22:21:33 GMT -5 saga6th said:

Ok I have a feeling looking at the posts that I am going to get alot of angry responses. Luke is my favorite and I would argue the most powerful Jedi to date. Following thread of defeats Obi-Wan beat Maul, Dooku beat Obi-Wan Ep III Anakin pawns Dooku after he owns Obi-Wan,(granted Obi-Wan beats Anakin in Ep III but there were extenuating circumstances and Vader kills him later) Luke after just 5 years of training most of which was on his own defeated Vader phyisically and mentally. Vader also defeated the Emporer who knew Anankin was stronger. The Emporer also technically beat Yoda admittedly not by much. So if we follow are thread to the end we find Luke on top of them all. Also in the books Luke deals with one aspiring conquerer or sith after another becoming extremely powerful. Last but not least ep V and VI Luke just oozes cool choking Gamorean Gaurds who get in his way. Hacking Wampa's arm off. Fighting Vader after lets face not more than a month of formal training and surviving. Kid has power. I have a lot more to say but I don't want to take up any more space.

Karma point for you!

[Otterling]

I'd honestly have to agree that Luke is pretty awesome. Most people note his whining in the first movie but honestly, think about how old he was. How much whining did YOU do at 17? He was never formally trained until he met Obi-wan so take that into account. All the great Jedi of the old order had been taken in from birth and trained. They had a 17 year head start on Luke. As for his later self doubt in the books, bear in mind that we ALL doubt ourselves from time to time. Look at Obi-wan (arguably one of the best Jedi EVER). Even he suffered from doubt from time to time. To be 17, have your whole world turned upside down, be told you have to defeat an empire, learn at some point that the galaxy's leading bada$$ is your DAD and that you have to defeat him, and then somehow still make it through all that sucessfully?? Yeah, he had a right to whine for a while. I don't think the character would have been as interesting otherwise. To me, that shallow simpleness of his youth is what helps make him such a great character. If he started off fantastic and just got better from there, he'd be boring. The fact that we get to watch him grow as a person and yet still see that humanity under the mantle of the Jedi, the moments of weakness or heartbreak. I think that those things lend him a more realistic quality and make him someone we can all identify with a lot easier. He's not the perfect Jedi. I can agree with that. But he IS a gripping and compelling character and that makes him pretty dang awesome.

[Jace]

Nov 16, 2009 22:21:33 GMT -5 saga6th said:

Ok I have a feeling looking at the posts that I am going to get alot of angry responses. Luke is my favorite and I would argue the most powerful Jedi to date. Following thread of defeats Obi-Wan beat Maul, Dooku beat Obi-Wan Ep III Anakin pawns Dooku after he owns Obi-Wan,(granted Obi-Wan beats Anakin in Ep III but there were extenuating circumstances and Vader kills him later) Luke after just 5 years of training most of which was on his own defeated Vader phyisically and mentally. Vader also defeated the Emporer who knew Anankin was stronger. The Emporer also technically beat Yoda admittedly not by much. So if we follow are thread to the end we find Luke on top of them all. Also in the books Luke deals with one aspiring conquerer or sith after another becoming extremely powerful. Last but not least ep V and VI Luke just oozes cool choking Gamorean Gaurds who get in his way. Hacking Wampa's arm off. Fighting Vader after lets face not more than a month of formal training and surviving. Kid has power. I have a lot more to say but I don't want to take up any more space.

While this approach is logical, I don't think it really works for many things. I know people have used this same logic when discussing which anime character or superhero is more powerful than the next. Yet to me the if A is greater than B and B is greater than C, therefore A is greater than C, logic doesn't really work.

my point is that if Yoda wasn't 92839289042803 years old, there would be no need for Luke at all. Yoda in his prime would tank Luke in his prime

While Luke is indeed still probably one if not the most powerful Jedi, that doesn't make him not a pansy. To me, he just never had that air of badassery around him. Its true that at 17 anyone would whine.....anyone but....MACE WINDU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Conclusion: Mace Windu is TEH SHIZZ

[Skyla]

Nov 30, 2009 18:37:19 GMT -5 Jace said:

Conclusion: Mace Windu is TEH SHIZZ

so true ^^

My vote is that though luke was okay, there were many better Jedi. So to me he is only half Pansy.

[Mara]

Nov 28, 2009 3:21:43 GMT -5 Otterling said:

I'd honestly have to agree that Luke is pretty awesome. Most people note his whining in the first movie but honestly, think about how old he was. How much whining did YOU do at 17? He was never formally trained until he met Obi-wan so take that into account. All the great Jedi of the old order had been taken in from birth and trained. They had a 17 year head start on Luke. As for his later self doubt in the books, bear in mind that we ALL doubt ourselves from time to time. Look at Obi-wan (arguably one of the best Jedi EVER). Even he suffered from doubt from time to time. To be 17, have your whole world turned upside down, be told you have to defeat an empire, learn at some point that the galaxy's leading bada$$ is your DAD and that you have to defeat him, and then somehow still make it through all that sucessfully?? Yeah, he had a right to whine for a while. I don't think the character would have been as interesting otherwise. To me, that shallow simpleness of his youth is what helps make him such a great character. If he started off fantastic and just got better from there, he'd be boring. The fact that we get to watch him grow as a person and yet still see that humanity under the mantle of the Jedi, the moments of weakness or heartbreak. I think that those things lend him a more realistic quality and make him someone we can all identify with a lot easier. He's not the perfect Jedi. I can agree with that. But he IS a gripping and compelling character and that makes him pretty dang awesome.

*hugs Otter*

[Ashi]

well, I know I'm joining this discussion rather late, but I'm of the opinion that luke is an idiot who was turned into a god and doesn't know what to do with himself. In fact, I don't think he ever got to the point he could decently plan any decent engagement (save starfighters) with any expectation of victory. So, no matter the attempt made by numerous EU authors (the only one of which I truely respect being Zahn) to turn him into something more, I still say he's a pansy.

[hapan]

If he would have been born earlier and received the same training as other Jedi he would be just as good if not better then any other Jedi you put him against. With the lack of training he had he still became a great Jedi master so I am going with awesome on this one. Plus with out him there would be no Ben Skywalker.

[T and J]

granted Obi-Wan beats Anakin in Ep III but there were extenuating circumstances and Vader kills him later

Obi-wan all but chucked his lightsaber over his shoulder and taped "stab me" across his forehead. He threw that duel so he could commune with Luke from the great beyond.

Vader also defeated the Emporer who knew Anankin was stronger

Sure, Vader Sparta-threw him into a reactor shaft thingamajig, but he died, too, and the Emporer was busy PWNZRING Luke, anyway. Hardly a resounding victory.

That being said, I'm not saying Luke's a bad character... he does take on wampas, rancors, AT-AT's, hallucinations, inhospitable conditions.... in the movies alone. So, really, I dunno.

Can't we just agree that Yoda pwns them all?


And, yes, I realize this thread is a year old. But if I don't speak my mind about this one, I won't sleep tonight...

[sparrow]

I don't think not being able to beat Palpatine when you started the series as a twenty year old farmboy whose most exciting hobby was taking potshots at womp rats is something to be too ashamed of.

[Regnier]

Young Luke = Pansy

Mature-ish Luke = Acceptable

Wisened Luke = Fairly awesome.

However, even at his most shining moments, he still pales in comparison to the epicness of Kyle Katarn.

Battlemaster for the WIN.